Vitamin D3 deficiency and HMS

[paw]

I recently had blood tests done and both my vitamin D and calcium levels were good, which my doctor thought was a bit surprising but excellent. I take a multi-vitamin and also a calcium with vitamin D tablet daily. I will continue to take them even though I expect to keep building poor bone compared to other people.

I hope it will at least slow down the decline now that I am not very active. Having good levels of calcium and vitamin D HAS to be better than having low levels. I just hope it is enough to keep me from fractures like others in my family have had.

[gillycharlie32]

Just another quick pointer!

Following Osteopenia diagnosis along with HMS from a long while before of course, a visit to the most recent physio who now tells me that the best thing I can do to curb the amount of bone loss over the next 5 years is .............wait for it.........aerobic exercise!

She also said 'I don't know much about Osteoporosis' and went on to ask if I could do a few pelvic tilts at home instead perhaps!

I mean what is the world coming to. The GP wrote to her specifically to aks for 'safe, effective and balanced' input on how to combine HMS with bone health. A complete and utter waste of NHS time I'm afraid and another nail in the coffin for getting the right support.

If anyone else is interested I have decided myself to aim for the following as a regime to at least keep things to a minimum:

Dairy free, wheat free, additive free, low acid, caffine and alcohol free diet all freshly cooked and supplemented with 'the best I can afford' calcium and Vit D.

Daily gentle strengthening exercises in a Pilates fashion, along with walking where possible. Core stability practice everyday and resistance training once week at the local gym when possible.

I had written (early Oct) to a panel of specialists for further explantions on why Osteopenia isn't treated more seriously in this country and have no reply whatsoever!

Whatever happens now is all in the lap of the Gods I presume!

Gilly

[Eloise]

Gilly - aerobic exercise doesn't help osteopenia - but weight bearning exercise does. This can include simple (or more difficult for some) exercise like walking. Basically to encourage calcium to go into the bones needs the action of muscles on the bones while holding the body up. Therefore, aerobic swimming doesnot encourage bone strength, but non-aerobic walking does!

So your regimen of core-stability will be good - especially with a bit of walking (or hobbling) up to your limit. Also, a good healthy diet will help, especially if enriched with vitamin D. Calcium with vitamin D supplements are good (esp if you can get 800iu per day of vitamin D) - and you can try asking the pharmacy counter as you maybe able to get better supplements at cheaper prices.

[Rosebud]

GillyCharlie,

If you have actual osteopenia you shouldn't rely on the supplements you can buy yourself over the counter. Your GP should have put you on prescribed supplements with the proper forms of Vit D & Calcium. If I were you I'd go back and ask them to put you on AdCal-D3 as they will have enough in them to actually make a difference. The regular multivitamins and vitamin supplements you buy in health stores usually only give you the "recommended daily dose" or a certain percentage of the RDD. That's not what you need with osteopaenia...you have a significant deficiency so you need much higher levels to boost you back to normal plasma levels or the supplements wont do you (or your bones) any good.

[Eloise]

It is best to get supplements with the correct amount of calcium and vitamin D - rosebud is right many supplements are only at the recommended daily dose (rda) for fit and healthy adults with no deficiencies, rather than a replacement dosage needed to correct a deficiency. If you can get your GP to prescribe a correct product - then it will be cheaper and easier. However, all the ones that are recommended and prescribable are also available to buy from your Pharmacy (but probably not health food shops etc). I would recommend: Adcal D3, Calcichew D3 forte or Calceos tablets. These all need chewing and taste like chalk (as they are). There are a couple of soluble versions that make chalk tasting drinks - these are Cacit D3 granules and Calfovit D3 powder.

Although they are all basically chalk with the correct amount of vitamin D added - they do have various different flavouring such as lemon, tutti-frutti etc - so you may find one that you think is slightly more platable than the others. Personally I prefer the tutti-frutti Adcal D3 - I bought a box of each for a education stand so all my GPs and nurses could try them and know what they were inflicting on their patients lol.

[Fiona-Jane]

These all need chewing and taste like chalk (as they are). .

hiya,

i've just be put on a new sort of calcichew-D3 that can be also swallowed as a tablet. you can chew it too but it tastes awful. i'm the first person my doctor has put on this type of calcium&vit D tablet and i prefer being able to swallow it, but the tablet is massive so it may put off many people, particularly those who struggle to swallow tablets. luckily i dont have that problem any more

fi xx

[Stone]

I take Calcichew D3, they're a bit orangey. (I also liken it to eating chalk! Maybe while someone next to you is eating oranges)

Actually after a year or so I quite like them

Stone

[gillycharlie32]

Thanks for the input everyone on the calcium tablets. The reason I'm buying my own in a vegan form is because ALL prescribed Calcium etc has either colours or additives that my gut won't tolerate. I've been through Mimms with my GP and both she and the chief dietician I am under say there is nothing on prescription that will suit.

As I have multiple food intolerances then this is the only route I can go down. I'm taking //// of calcium citrate and //// of Vit D a day. This is what my GP has suggested is suitable unless anyone has any other ideas they would like to put forward. Not necessarily doses but whether you believe these are too low or too high perhaps?

Gilly

Mod edit - dosage details removed, please read site rules. In this situation these count as medication.

[gillycharlie32]

Eloise

Thanks for your input. Apologies for the fauxpa on my last, I wouldn't have considered calcium as a medication but certainly have taken on board the reprimand.

No wish to drone on but I'm wondering if any dose suggested is considered to be in 'addition' to that obtained from the diet or a total intake which includes that from the diet?

My recommended dose was worked out after analysing what I was already getting from my food. Surely if we are getting a good amount within the food we eat then the top-up situation is going to be less.

I'm also still very interested in the fact that many cultures get quite small amounts of calcium/Vit D from their diets and yet their hip fracture risks are also small in comparison with the Western world. Where studies have been done comparing those who have a low risk in their own culture with the same folk who now live in Western societies their fracture risk increases to equate with Europeans (implying that diet and lifestyle have a huge part to play in actually creating problems). This puts the whole idea of copious amounts of calcium into a different light doesn't it?

Of course it is a multifactoral situation I'm sure but there is much dispute around the whole idea of large amounts of calcium/Vit D being the best type of protection.

All we can do here I suppose is to take the advice we get from the current orthodox avenues, balance that within our own boundaries and then go with the flow.

Gilly

[Eloise]

I know someone at some point was wanting to know what was in each of the different calcium and vitamin D supplements (i.e. to check E numbers, sweetener, suitable for vegans etc). I now have found a four page word document summary of all the products with what they contain. So if anyone would like a copy please send me a PM.

[gillycharlie32]

Eloise
Have sent you a PM.
Gilly

[nemonie]

I have just started taking Adcal D3 dispersible, which is calcium and Vitamin D in a soluble tablet form. I was previously on calcium only Adcal, but my vit D levels continued to be very low, after my first injection last year I found the nasty chalky tablets really gross (even worse with dry mouth from my other meds) and would quite often just "forget" to take them

My new version dissolves in a small glass of water and is vaguely lemon flavoured and is actually not bad It's not suitable if you are diabetic or sensitive to certain sugars, but it's good if you have POTS, as it has quite a lot of s*d in the tablet It magically dosn't taste chalky at all, worth asking about?!

[anna]

Just a question. I used to be on calcichew but they flared up my ibs and reflux and GP took me off them. Is this common? I'm now on bonviva which I understand is the solution for my particular situation, but I'm interested in the experiences of my fellow chalk-eaters!! I do, by the way eat a very healthy calcium rich diet.

[Stone]

Hmm, I've been having reflux for a little while now. Hadn't linked it to the Calcichew so thank you!

No idea on your question though. Sorry

Stone

[Eloise]

Unfortunately bonvia is NOT a solution to the calcium tablet as it is a "bisphosphonate". You need BOTH! The calcium is the building blocks of the bones - there is no way round it - if you have osteoporosis/osteopaenia then you need to put more calcium in the bones. You also need vitamin D as this allows the calcium to be absorbed and transported around the body properly. All the bonvia (or other bisphosphonate) does is provide a mortar in the bones to make it sticky and allow the calcium to stick there and stay there. Without any calcium supplements then the bonvia can't actually do anything!

Normally it is the bisphosphonate that causes reflux and problems - hence the instructions to take it it on an empty stomach with lots of water and to stay upright for at least half an hour. Normally if you get reflux on the weekly one they transfer you to the monthly one (bonvia) just so that you only have the problem once a month rather than once a week (they don't seem to use the daily one anymore due to this).

There are quite a few brands of calcium and vitamin D, including some that can be dissolved and taken as a drink with people find more tolerable. Also, some people take the calcium tablets, one in a morning and one at night, rather than both together to help them tolerate it.

So anna - unless you drink loads and loads of milk (as in litres of the stuff) then you will need a calcium supplement otherwise the bonvia won't work - so please go back and discuss this with your GP (or Pharmacist).